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How are the league members selected?

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PtolemysXX
Uganda

How are the league members selected?

Post by PtolemysXX »

I wonder what criteria Duolingo uses to place people in a particular league. I have a feeling that it is somehow based on my geographical location. Of course it his hard to say for sure but looking at other league members' profiles and checking from what languages they learn I would say that my leaguemates live no further than two-three countries away. Being based in Europe I think I never run across learners from Eastern Asia, the Americas or Africa, not even from the Middle East. Personally I would love to have a more diversified mix to see what the learning habits are elsewhere in the world.

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SweNedGuy
Belgium

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by SweNedGuy »

Members for whom the leagues close at the same time UTC are clustered. Any league is progressively filled until it totals 30 members. On Monday this may only take a minute. If you join the leagues on Tuesday or Wednesday you will most likely notice you started in an incomplete league. After joining today, my (diamond) league contained only 8 members; it may take over an hour to fill completely.

Diamond and Obsidian leagues total most learners. Hence those leagues will also fill more rapidly than lower ranking leagues.

Whenever I run across DL members learning from Russian, Turkish or Arabic, I presume they live anywhere in Western or Central Europe. People with African sounding nicks usually learn from English or French. I don't know if they live in Europe or anywhere in Africa. (Note: only the western half of Africa is using UTC or UTC+1).

Speaking :netherlands: :fr: :uk: :es: Learning :de:(B2-) :it:(B1) Image :sweden: :portugal: Image (A)

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John Little
Brazil

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by John Little »

Recently, having dropped down from Diamond bit by bit to Emerald, I noticed the numbers increasing as I watched. I started as number 3 out of only 5 then steadily dropped down the league as more people came on. But none of my current league seem to be "high XP earners". So activity must be a factor

John661162

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PtolemysXX
Uganda

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by PtolemysXX »

SweNedGuy wrote: Wed Dec 21, 2022 1:36 pm

Members for whom the leagues close at the same time UTC are clustered.

So, do I understand it correctly that selection into a group is based on the time zone one is in? Or to phrase it differently, if I join the leages from a different timezone I will land in a completely different region and will also have a different weekly closure time in absolute terms (UTC)?

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John Little
Brazil

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by John Little »

I think time zone must play a part because of the cut off time. Here in the UK it's 10pm on Sunday.

Having said that, I strongly suspect there are a lot of Brasilians in the leagues I've been in and they're 4 hours behind the UK.

John661162

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SweNedGuy
Belgium

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by SweNedGuy »

John Little wrote: Wed Dec 21, 2022 11:00 pm

I think time zone must play a part because of the cut off time. Here in the UK it's 10pm on Sunday.

Having said that, I strongly suspect there are a lot of Brasilians in the leagues I've been in and they're 4 hours behind the UK.

Portugal is at UTC.
This being said, if the UK is closing at 10pm, this means that you close 2 hours later than over here in Belgium/France... at UTC+1, where the leagues close at 9 pm. Probably they are clustering us with UTC+2 Eastern-Europe (from Finland over the Baltic States to Romania Bulgaria and Greece)

Speaking :netherlands: :fr: :uk: :es: Learning :de:(B2-) :it:(B1) Image :sweden: :portugal: Image (A)

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FurbyZeKat
Switzerland

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by FurbyZeKat »

John Little wrote: Wed Dec 21, 2022 4:56 pm

But none of my current league seem to be "high XP earners". So activity must be a factor

I think so too. At the beginning of the week it seems that every league member has a similar XP profile of the past week.

It is also well known that if you want to win the Legendary achievement it is better to start late and make as few XP as possible for a while in the diamond league to be among low XP earners.

N French C1 English B2 German B1 Esperanto L Turkish

Deleted User 4833

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Deleted User 4833 »

Activity is a factor up to a point. I was in the Diamond League when I stopped doing Duolingo (for a variety of reasons) for 2 years. When I came back, I was surprised to see that I had only dropped to the Emerald League. After all that time of inactivity, I had expected to drop all the way back to the bottom! :D

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FurbyZeKat
Switzerland

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by FurbyZeKat »

One of my contacts (Michael) has a 1070 days streak with 106 weeks in the diamond league but only 6 top 3 finishes. His current weekly XP total is 577!

N French C1 English B2 German B1 Esperanto L Turkish

Deleted User 4833

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Deleted User 4833 »

I don't think I've ever had a top 3 finish in the Diamond League. Those folks are too fast for me. :D

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uralicnomad
Hungary

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by uralicnomad »

JudieLC wrote: Tue Jan 17, 2023 8:10 pm

I don't think I've ever had a top 3 finish in the Diamond League. Those folks are too fast for me. :D

Do your best to avoid getting caught up in the points trap, you'll look back and be a little annoyed with yourself with wasting that time instead of learning and not regurgitating what you already know.. although it's a pretty good confidence booster :)

Deleted User 4833

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Deleted User 4833 »

As it turns out, I may end up in the top 3 this week, for the first time ever. I'm in third place now, unless the fourth place person gets more points than me by tomorrow night. But it's just because I've been working on several different languages at once, I think.

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John Little
Brazil

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by John Little »

Well, I think I can say, quite conclusively, that its based on your scores the previous week.

I have been trying really hard to stay in the demotion zone and it is fighting back. However low I go, it puts me in a league i could win. So Ive left the leagues (again) to see where I am when i go back on Sunday. i have struggled to drop down from diamond to ruby

John661162

Deleted User 4833

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Deleted User 4833 »

I've switched my status to private and am out of the leagues for now. Also doing fewer lessons per day than I was cause I'm busy with other stuff. I'll be curious to see if I'm still in Diamond league when I decide to switch back to having a public profile.

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SweNedGuy
Belgium

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by SweNedGuy »

XP thresholds to stay in Diamond (even accounting for the time of the week of joining the leagues) vary wildly. I consistently report lower thresholds: this is because I am using the website exclusively. Hence we need to add another criterion to 'How are the league members selected?'.

  • Members using the website EXCLUSIVELY are clustered together.
  • Members using the app with possible intermittent use of the website are clustered together.

We already knew that members from the same time zone (+ possibly adjacent time zones) are clustered together. They share the closing time of their leagues.

Finally leagues are progressively filled: depending on the league and the moment of the week, this will be almost instantaneous (diamond and obsidian leagues on Mondays before 10pm) or take minutes to hours (lower leagues and/or later in the week). New entries to the leagues are halted on Friday evening.

Some of the above breakdowns may not be maintained later in the week or the stratification may be coarser (?)
I would like to get more info about people having joined a league on Thursday or Friday to draw valid conclusions.

Speaking :netherlands: :fr: :uk: :es: Learning :de:(B2-) :it:(B1) Image :sweden: :portugal: Image (A)

Deleted User 4833

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Deleted User 4833 »

I've posted a couple of screenshots and/or observations about my experiences joining leagues later in the week in the "How to progress in leagues" thread. My observations begin on this page more or less. Don't know if that's helpful.

I'm currently on private so I don't have to think about leagues, but will probably jump back in after Passover.

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Corinnebelle

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Corinnebelle »

What is the lowest number of members one has gotten in a league when they entered? I am just wondering how the leagues formed. Are people consecutively doing the first league lessons and get fitted in the same league then? How often do they make a new league? On the hour? Or as people do lessons at the same time?

🇺🇸 L1 🇮🇱 Advanced beginner Duolingo levels

Languages without borders, languages bridging gaps, the Red Cross are my heroes.

Deleted User 4833

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Deleted User 4833 »

When I waited till Thursday to go public, I was placed in a league with less than 10 members. It gradually filled up and maxed out at 15, as I explained here.

I've been in leagues with more than 15 when I joined a league early in the week, but I think most of my leagues from when I joined later in the week maxed out at 15.

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Corinnebelle

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Corinnebelle »

JudieLC wrote: Thu Mar 30, 2023 11:15 pm

When I waited till Thursday to go public, I was placed in a league with less than 10 members. It gradually filled up and maxed out at 15, as I explained here.

I've been in leagues with more than 15 when I joined a league early in the week, but I think most of my leagues from when I joined later in the week maxed out at 15.

So less competitors later on?

🇺🇸 L1 🇮🇱 Advanced beginner Duolingo levels

Languages without borders, languages bridging gaps, the Red Cross are my heroes.

Deleted User 4833

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Deleted User 4833 »

Corinnebelle wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 12:36 am
JudieLC wrote: Thu Mar 30, 2023 11:15 pm

When I waited till Thursday to go public, I was placed in a league with less than 10 members. It gradually filled up and maxed out at 15, as I explained here.

I've been in leagues with more than 15 when I joined a league early in the week, but I think most of my leagues from when I joined later in the week maxed out at 15.

So less competitors later on?

Seems plausible that there would be fewer competitors starting out later in the week. I would guess most people jump on getting started early in the week, as DL encourages us to do. I would guess leagues fill up quickly early in the week.

When people join later in the week, I'm guessing new leagues are formed in order to not overload the already exisiting leagues. And there are probably fewer people joining later in the week, so fewer in each new league. I'm guessing they wouldn't want an isolated newcomer late in the week to end up in a league by themselves, so they leave space in late-forming leagues for last minute joiners.

But that's all just guessing.

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Corinnebelle

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Corinnebelle »

@JudieLC Bigger leagues usually have 30 people right? 10 promoted, 10 staying in the league and 10 demoted.

🇺🇸 L1 🇮🇱 Advanced beginner Duolingo levels

Languages without borders, languages bridging gaps, the Red Cross are my heroes.

Deleted User 4833

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Deleted User 4833 »

Corinnebelle wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 1:26 am

@JudieLC Bigger leagues usually have 30 people right? 10 promoted, 10 staying in the league and 10 demoted.

Yes, I've been in leagues with that many people when I joined right away. Some leagues I think only the bottom 5 are demoted, but I don't remember specifically.

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Stasia
Poland

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Stasia »

JudieLC wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 3:49 am

Yes, I've been in leagues with that many people when I joined right away. Some leagues I think only the bottom 5 are demoted, but I don't remember specifically.

In the Diamond league only bottom 5 get demoted.

I don't think I've ever been in a league that had less than 30 people, even when I entered late in the week. The late week leagues take a while to fill, though, so if you are lucky to be one of the first ones, you get an early start comparing to other participants, and if you are one of the last ones, as you join you notice that while you have 20 points, the top dog already has several hundred.

Native: :poland:; Fluent: :es:, :us:; Getting there: Image; Intermediate: :fr:; Beginner: :ukraine:

Deleted User 4833

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Deleted User 4833 »

Stasia wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 6:16 pm
JudieLC wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 3:49 am

Yes, I've been in leagues with that many people when I joined right away. Some leagues I think only the bottom 5 are demoted, but I don't remember specifically.

In the Diamond league only bottom 5 get demoted.

I don't think I've ever been in a league that had less than 30 people, even when I entered late in the week. The late week leagues take a while to fill, though, so if you are lucky to be one of the first ones, you get an early start comparing to other participants, and if you are one of the last ones, as you join you notice that while you have 20 points, the top dog already has several hundred.

I was in a league with only 15 people 2 or 3 times, when I joined late Thursday or late Friday.

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SweNedGuy
Belgium

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by SweNedGuy »

Tiny 15 member leagues for those joining very late in the week... Interesting to know. Unfortunately that also implies that a larger fraction of participants will demote. In a lower league the silver lining is twice the usual fraction of members promoting. In Diamond it seems better to join on Wednesday at the last.

Speaking :netherlands: :fr: :uk: :es: Learning :de:(B2-) :it:(B1) Image :sweden: :portugal: Image (A)

Deleted User 4833

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Deleted User 4833 »

SweNedGuy wrote: Sat Apr 01, 2023 11:26 pm

Tiny 15 member leagues for those joining very late in the week... Interesting to know. Unfortunately that also implies that a larger fraction of participants will demote. In a lower league the silver lining is twice the usual fraction of members promoting. In Diamond it seems better to join on Wednesday at the last.

It has worked out okay for me to join late in the week, so far. Usually has less active learners so I've had no trouble staying out of the demotion zone, so far.

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SweNedGuy
Belgium

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by SweNedGuy »

The Duolingo team published a blog on the functioning of leaderboards and the selection of participants.

They don't show the back of their tongue, but most of the observations covered in this thread are being confirmed.

Speaking :netherlands: :fr: :uk: :es: Learning :de:(B2-) :it:(B1) Image :sweden: :portugal: Image (A)

Deleted User 4833

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Deleted User 4833 »

SweNedGuy wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 9:13 am

The Duolingo team published a blog on the functioning of leaderboards and the selection of participants.

They don't show the back of their tongue, but most of the observations covered in this thread are being confirmed.

Interesting.

We all know that the leaderboards aren't strictly "based on your study efforts", as there are people engaged in XP farming with, I suspect, not as much learning going on.

Also "they don't show the back of their tongue" is an expression I haven't heard before. :)

Deleted User 4833

Re: How are the league members selected?

Post by Deleted User 4833 »

In other news, I maintained my fourth place finish in the Diamond tournament and am now in the finals.

I'll wait till tonight to go private.

I like to get congratulated by my friends. :)
Can't see that when you're in private mode. :P

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