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Number of skills versus the number of units

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jzsuzsi

Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by jzsuzsi »

Hello!

In the Tree layout, every course had some skills, and now on the Path (Snake) there are units.
But there is a connection, since in the background, they still have the tree structure, it is just displayed differently.

My guess (based on a few courses I checked) is that there are two new skills appearing in each unit, and there are roughly 10 practice units at the end, so the number of units is close to (skills/2 +10). But not exactly. Sometimes there are more (or fewer) personalized practice units at the end.
And if the course has stories too, there will be more units.

The following table was based on https://magyarbagoly.blogspot.com/2022/ ... ourse.html, which was based on http://ardslot.com/duolingocrowns.html

I checked the number of Units here on the Duome Forum, based on MatOzone's posts.

Sometimes there are multiple versions of the same course, where I knew, I marked them "old" and "new" .
Sometimes I write the number of units as "X or Y", in this case, probably there are also two different versions of the course available but I don't know which is which or I'm not sure of the skill count in the newer version.

Here, "old" means that it is old enough to show up in https://liuch.github.io/duolingo_courses_overview/ (FieryCat stopped updating that list in 2021)
"New" means it is the newest version that is available to some users.

I intentionally left out the numbers for Spanish/French/German/Japanese: too many competing versions to keep track.
Edit: I added the number of units for these courses too, and I picked the longest version.

LANGUAGE FROM SKILLS LESSONS Words Units Stories?Tips?
Arabic (AR)  English  46 210 1481 30 no no
Chinese (ZS) English  88 284 1932 57 no yes
Czech old English  84 422 2362 54 no no
Czech new English  88 422 2626 57 no no
Danish old English  70 340 2341 45 no no
Danish new English  62 ? ? 40 no no
Dutch (DN) English  123 502 2933 79 no no
Esperanto (EO) English  69 364 2389 45 no no
Finnish (FI) English  35 144 1007 23 no no
French (FR) English  a lot a lot a lot [219] yes yes
German (DE) English  a lot a lot a lot [131] yes yes
Greek old English  74 278 2010 ? no no
Greek new English  95 432 3196 61 no no
Greek another English  102 452 3218 ? no no
Haitian Creole (HT) English  36 125 728 23 no no
Hawaiian old English  38 143 799 24 no no
Hawaiian another English  51 ? ? 33 no no
Hebrew (HE) English  84 446 2833 54 no no
High Valyrian old English  38 135 825 ? no no
High Valyrian new English  43 157 982 28 no no
Hindi (HI) English  32 133 656 21 no no
Hungarian old  English  78 319 2367 51 no no
Hungarian new English  110 489 3176 71 no no
Indonesian (ID) English  69 310 1882 44 no no
Irish (GA) English  64 292 1711 42 no no
Italian old English  66 405 2784 51 yes yes
Italian new English  98 565 3753 72 yes yes
Japanese (JA) English  a lot a lot a lot [132] yes yes
Klingon old English  62 238 1481 ? no no
Klingon new English  65 248 1533 42 no no
Korean old English  65 258 1793 ? no no
Korean newer English  94 351 2230 61 no no
Korean newest English  112 431 2684 72 no no
Latin (LA) English  22 81 538 14 no no
Navajo (NV) English  11 28 143 7 no no
Norwegian old English  172 590 3600 111 no no
Norwegian new English  246 1008 5784 159 no no
Polish (PL) English  67 298 1938 43 no no
Portuguese (PT) English  91 463 2919 75 yes yes
Romanian (RO) English  62 286 2405 40 no no
Russian old English  79 350 2279 51 no no
Russian new English  95 405 2601 61 no no
Scottish Gaelic (GD) English  107 483 3525 69 no no
Spanish (ES) English  a lot a lot a lot [230] yes yes
Swahili old English  65 195 1257 42 no no
Swahili new English  73 243 1535 47 no no
Swedish old English  66 325 2361 43 no no
Swedish new English  85 376 2549 55 no no
Turkish (TR) English  67 200 1466 43 no no
Ukranian (UK) English  51 209 1108 33 no no
Vietnamese old English  84 320 1661 54 no no
Vietnamese new English  75 336 1775 49 no no
Welsh (CY) old English  118 416 2366 ?? no no
Yiddish (YI) English  94 382 2297 61 no no
Zulu (ZU) English  20 91 628 13 no no
English (EN) Hungarian 55 285 1952 49 yes no
German (DE) Hungarian 51 238 1631 44 yes no
Last edited by jzsuzsi on Tue Jan 16, 2024 2:00 pm, edited 14 times in total.
tooraloorali

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by tooraloorali »

Thanks for writing this out! I created a new user "testitalian", and got some numbers for the Italian (new) course that you could fill in.

New: 98 skills, 565 lessons, 3753 lexemes

new_italian_overview.jpg
new_italian_overview.jpg (19.8 KiB) Viewed 1203 times

As compared to old: 66 skills, 405 lessons, 2784 lexemes

old_italian_overview.jpg
old_italian_overview.jpg (20.56 KiB) Viewed 1203 times

Now if only I could get them to update the course I have with my 10 year old user! I'd love to get at those 1000 new words :D

User avatar
jzsuzsi

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by jzsuzsi »

Thanks @tooraloorali !

Now that I saw the tree image in viewtopic.php?p=66688-italian-from-engl ... its#p66688
I believe you that the newest Italian course has 98 skills.

Nice. I guess they will add even more new skills when they are moving ahead with the Cefr redesign...

User avatar
jzsuzsi

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by jzsuzsi »

Side note: for Italian, there is a version with 76 skills, which is not included in my beautiful table, but it is newer than the 66 skill version and older than the 98 skill version.

User avatar
jzsuzsi

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by jzsuzsi »

[deleted by me]

Last edited by jzsuzsi on Sun Oct 15, 2023 2:17 am, edited 4 times in total.
User avatar
jzsuzsi

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by jzsuzsi »

New table.

After Duolingo rearranged the order of the bubbles, the number of units changed in several courses.
I copied the info (the "units now" part) from https://duolingodata.com/

Notation: boldface means this is the currently available version, and if there are multiple versions out there with AB testing, then boldface means the newer version

LANGUAGE FROM SKILLS LESSONS Words Units before Units now
Arabic (AR)  English  46 210 1481 30 30
Chinese (ZS) English  88 284 1932 57 57
Czech old English  84 422 2362 54 55
Czech new English  88 422 2626 57 57
Danish old English  70 340 2341 45
Danish new English  62 ? ? 40 41
Dutch (DN) English  123 502 2933 79 80
Esperanto (EO) English  69 364 2389 45 45
Finnish (FI) English  35 144 1007 23 23
French (FR) English  a lot a lot a lot [219] [194]
German (DE) English  a lot a lot a lot [131] [102]
Greek old English  74 278 2010
Greek new English  95 432 3196 61 62
Greek another English  102 452 3218
Haitian Creole (HT) English  36 125 728 23 23
Hawaiian old English  38 143 799 24 25
Hawaiian another English  51 ? ? 33
Hebrew (HE) English  84 446 2833 54 56
High Valyrian old English  38 135 825
High Valyrian new English  43 157 982 28 28
Hindi (HI) English  32 133 656 21 20
Hungarian old  English  78 319 2367 51
Hungarian new English  110 489 3176 71 71
Indonesian (ID) English  69 310 1882 44 45
Irish (GA) English  64 292 1711 42 43
Italian old English  66 405 2784 51
Italian new English  98 565 3753 72
Italian newer English  123 ? ? 79
Klingon old English  62 238 1481
Klingon new English  65 248 1533 42 43
Korean old English  65 258 1793
Korean newer English  94 351 2230 61
Korean newest English  112 431 2684 72 73
Latin (LA) English  22 81 538 14 14
Navajo (NV) English  11 28 143 7 7
Norwegian old English  172 590 3600 111
Norwegian new English  246 1008 5784 159 161
Polish (PL) English  67 298 1938 43 44
Portuguese (PT) English  91 463 2919 75 60
Romanian (RO) English  62 286 2405 40 41
Russian old English  79 350 2279 51
Russian new English  95 405 2601 61 62
Scottish Gaelic old English  107 483 3525 69 70
Scottish Gaelic new English  120 ? ? ? 78
Spanish (ES) English  a lot a lot a lot [230] [205]
Swahili old English  65 195 1257 42
Swahili new English  73 243 1535 47 48
Swedish old English  66 325 2361 43
Swedish new English  85 376 2549 55 55
Turkish (TR) English  67 200 1466 43 44
Ukranian (UK) English  51 209 1108 33 33
Vietnamese old English  84 320 1661 54
Vietnamese new English  75 336 1775 49 48
Welsh old English  118 416 2366 ? ?
Welsh new English  107 390 2365 69 70
Yiddish (YI) English  94 382 2297 61 62
Zulu (ZU) English  20 91 628 13 13
English old Hungarian 55 285 1952 49 ?
English new Hungarian ? ? ? ? 109/160
German (DE) Hungarian 51 238 1631 44 33?
Last edited by jzsuzsi on Wed Feb 14, 2024 5:27 pm, edited 15 times in total.
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PtolemysXX
Uganda

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by PtolemysXX »

I wonder how the number of words is calculated. duolingodata.com gets its data from json files currentCourse. The number of words shows up in the currentCourse files (tag "numberOfWords") but the actual word list is not available there. Can that list be retrieved somehow? It is different from the list available for each user under www.duolingo.com/vocabulary/overview. The latter is typically much longer because it contains all inflected forms of the same word with different pre- or suffixes.

Last edited by PtolemysXX on Mon Oct 09, 2023 5:52 am, edited 2 times in total.
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jzsuzsi

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by jzsuzsi »

I have my own strategy for number of words (lexemes)

A long time ago, when I had incubator access, I checked it in the incubator.

Now that I cannot do that, I usually go to the duome page for that language, like https://duome.eu/en/eo, check the top users who completed the course, (ignore the outliers who are probably cheating) and check the lexemes column.

Last edited by Corinnebelle on Mon Oct 09, 2023 5:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Minor spelling error
User avatar
jzsuzsi

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by jzsuzsi »

PtolemysXX wrote: Sun Oct 08, 2023 6:13 pm

but the actual word list is not available there. Can that list be retrieved somehow?

I'm not sure, maybe if you have a Duolingo for Schools account, you can get it, like how dakanga was posting Overview post like this: viewtopic.php?t=13869-duolingo-path-overview-79-units

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jzsuzsi

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by jzsuzsi »

Italian tree versions

LANGUAGE FROM SKILLS LESSONS Words Units beforeUnits now
Italian old English  66 405 2784 51 43
Italian 2? English  76 ? ? 57 ?
Italian 3? English  98 565 3753 72 ?
Italian 4? English  123 ? ? ? 79

viewtopic.php?t=20281-italian-course-79-units

Last edited by jzsuzsi on Sun Jan 21, 2024 9:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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jzsuzsi

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by jzsuzsi »

Scottish Gaelic tree versions

LANGUAGE FROM SKILLS LESSONS Words Units beforeUnits now
Scottish Gaelic oldest English  34 164 ? x x
Scottish Gaelic 2 English  107 483 3525 69 ?
Scottish Gaelic 3 English  120 ? ? ? 78

viewtopic.php?t=20282-scottish-gaelic-course-78-units

Last edited by jzsuzsi on Wed Jan 31, 2024 12:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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jzsuzsi

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by jzsuzsi »

User avatar
jzsuzsi

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by jzsuzsi »

Now, I'm cutting the table into two categories.

Likely to be frozen in time (not sure about Portuguese )

LANGUAGE FROM SKILLS LESSONS Words Units before Units now
Arabic (AR)  English  46 210 1481 30 30
Czech old English  84 422 2362 54 55
Czech new English  88 422 2626 57 57
Danish old English  70 340 2341 45 47
Danish new English  62 ? ? 40 41
Dutch (DN) English  123 502 2933 79 80
Esperanto (EO) English  69 364 2389 45 45
Finnish (FI) English  35 144 1007 23 23
Greek old English  74 278 2010 x
Greek new English  95 432 3196 61 62
Greek another English  102 452 3218 ?
Haitian Creole (HT) English  36 125 728 23 23
Hawaiian old English  38 143 799 24 25
Hawaiian another English  51 ? ? 33 x
Hebrew (HE) English  84 446 2833 54 56
High Valyrian old English  38 135 825 ? x
High Valyrian new English  43 157 982 28 28
Hindi (HI) English  32 133 656 21 20
Hungarian old  English  78 319 2367 51 x
Hungarian new English  110 489 3176 71 71
Indonesian (ID) English  69 310 1882 44 45
Irish (GA) English  64 292 1711 42 43
Klingon old English  62 238 1481 x x
Klingon new English  65 248 1533 42 43
Latin (LA) English  22 81 538 14 14
Navajo (NV) English  11 28 143 7 7
Norwegian old English  172 590 3600 111 x
Norwegian new English  246 1008 5784 159 161
Polish (PL) English  67 298 1938 43 44
Portuguese (PT) English  91 463 2919 75 60
Romanian (RO) English  62 286 2405 40 41
Russian old English  79 350 2279 51 x
Russian new English  95 405 2601 61 62
Scottish Gaelic old English  107 483 3525 69 70
Scottish Gaelic new English  120 ? ? ? 78
Swahili old English  65 195 1257 42 x
Swahili new English  73 243 1535 47 48
Swedish old English  66 325 2361 43 x
Swedish new English  85 376 2549 55 55
Turkish (TR) English  67 200 1466 43 44
Ukranian (UK) English  51 209 1108 33 33
Vietnamese old English  84 320 1661 54 x
Vietnamese new English  75 336 1775 49 48
Welsh old English  118 416 2366 ? ?
Welsh new English  107 390 2365 69 70
Yiddish (YI) English  94 382 2297 61 62
Zulu (ZU) English  20 91 628 13 13

Likely to receive updates:

LANGUAGE FROM SKILLS LESSONS Words Units before Units now
Chinese old English  88 284 1932 57 57
Chinese newEnglish67 43
French (FR) English  a lot a lot a lot [311]
German (DE) English  a lot a lot a lot [102]
Italian old English  66 405 2784 51 x
Italian new English  98 565 3753 72 ?
Italian newer English  123 ? ? ? 79
JapaneseEnglisha lot121/143/212
Korean old English  65 258 1793 x x
Korean newer English  94 351 2230 61 x
Korean newest English  112 431 2684 72 73
Spanish (ES) English  a lot a lot a lot 205/327
Last edited by jzsuzsi on Fri Mar 08, 2024 2:25 pm, edited 4 times in total.
User avatar
PtolemysXX
Uganda

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by PtolemysXX »

What is the division into "likely to receive updates" and "likely to be frozen" based on? Was it some anouncement from Duolingo?

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jzsuzsi

Re: Number of skills versus the number of units

Post by jzsuzsi »

PtolemysXX wrote: Fri Feb 02, 2024 8:58 pm

What is the division into "likely to receive updates" and "likely to be frozen" based on? Was it some anouncement from Duolingo?

Gossips from ex-contributors...

Duolingo made some comments on Reddit, but it was far from a real announcement

Chinese update:

generic about courses:

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