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får

User avatar
Will709432

får

Post by Will709432 »

Still, years after starting Swedish, having problems with får

Take this sentence for example:
Snart fick den (a monkey in the story) tag i ett av mina rockskört och drog mig till sig.

I don't see why fick is used here. Looks as if rearranged slightly it could do quite well without it, unless there is something I'm not quite getting about the way Swedish uses this word.

Here's another which might make my problem clearer:
Folk slogs om att få komma in.

Why not just say they fought to get in without using få?

And another,

Jag lyckades övertala henne att få följa med en tjänare till stranden.

Why not leave out få?

And this: Han fick rätt. Looks as if it means was here as well as everything it can mean :?

Explanations online don't really make the use clear. I see this all the time in my reading and I understand when it's used almost like "have to", betjänterna fick fylla det med vatten, som... had to fill it with water. But there are so many uses that don't seem to be necessary, so clearly there is something I'm not grasping about its use. You can probably see, in the most recent story I did on here, Plan B, I tried hard to avoid using this kind of thing, which is probably not a good idea, as it means being handicapped by it.
Can anyone enlighten me a bit maybe. Maybe somebody can give me a better explanation than the muddled ones I keep finding online.

User avatar
Crahdol
Japan

Re: får

Post by Crahdol »

Hey [mention]Will709432[/mention]

Att få is a very nuanced verb, so it's not suprising learners of the the Swedish language struggle with it. I also feel like it is rarely explained other than through examples, which doesn't really help.

First of all, let's get some things out of the way.

  • can also bee an adjective meaning 'few'

  • Får, in addition to being the dictionary for of the verb, is also a noun, meaning 'sheep'

Now, on to the verb...

If you look upp att få in a dictionary or online translator, it will probably tell you it means 'to get'. And if you're lucky you'll get a list of other translations, but these won't help without context.
The general nuance of att få is to indicate 'recieving' an action from someone, if that makes sense.

Let's look at your examples, and try to exclude :
Snart fick den tag i ett av mina rockskört = 'Soon, it got a hold on one of my coat-tails.'
Snart tog den tag i ett av mina rockskört = 'Soon, it grabbed a hold on one of my coat-tails.'
In this case, excluding , switchs the focus from the fact that it grabbed the coat-tail, to the ACT of grabbing the coat-tail.

Folk slogs om att få komma in. = 'People fought to be let in.'
Folk slogs om att komma in. = 'People fought to get in.'
In this case, adds the nuance that people were wight to BE ALLOWED to get in.

Jag lyckades övertala henne att få följa med en tjänare till stranden. = 'I managed to convince her to be allowed to go with a servant to the beach.'
Jag lyckades övertala henne att följa med en tjänare till stranden. = 'I managed to convince her to go with a servant to the beach.'
As you can see, without , this meaning has quite a different meaning. With the speaker convinces "her" to be allowed to go, while without the speaker convinces "her" to go.

Han fick rätt = 'He was in the right.'
Han hade rätt = 'He was right.'
Again, this has the nuance of indication that "he" is recieving being right, rather than simply being right. The former is usually somthing that is officially decided, for example by winning a court case, and not commonly used in everyday language.

I'll make a list of some of the most common ways to use att få that I can think of. If you come across something that doesn't fit these uses, don't hesitate to ask.

  1. att få = 'to get/recieve'.
    Ex: Jag fick en cykel av mina föräldrar. = 'I got a bicycle from my parents.[/b]

  2. att få tag i = 'to get/grab a hold of'.
    Ex: Snart fick den tag i ett av mina rockskört och drog mig till sig = 'Soon, it got a hold of one of my coat-tails and pulled me towards them.'

  3. att få <verb> = 'to be allowed to <verb>/to have to <verb>.'
    Ex: Jag lyckades övertala henne att få följa med en tjänare till stranden. = 'I managed to convince her to be allowed to go with a servant to the beach.

Vänliga hälsningar/Best Regards/よろしくお願いします
Crahdol
| 🇸🇪: Native | 🇬🇧: Fluent | 🇯🇵: N5 |

User avatar
Will709432

Re: får

Post by Will709432 »

Thanks a lot.

Yes, att få is very troublesome for me. Thanks for explaining the examples.

I have a couple of others from the book I'm reading.

Bara vänta tills du får möta en riktig riddare....said by a dwarf to a wannabe knight.

I understand that this means "wait until you get to meet a real knight", in the same way as we would say that in English, although even in English I cant really say why we say it like that instead of saying "wait until you meet a real knight" without saying wait until you get to... So I'll let this one pass. :)

I also think I've seen fick/få used when something is encountered for the first time or is unexpected, or get a chance to encounter something, but I can't be sure - as in, wait until you meet her (get a chance to meet her), or when you see the house for the first time (get a chance to encounter something). So the above makes sense in that context, getting to meet a knight for the first time if my thinking on this is not wrong. (Probably is wrong, lol)

Another one:

De såg varken hus eller skjul där, så de fick sova på marken.

Why did they "get" to sleep on the floor? I think this is like the water sentence in that they "had" to do something, had to sleep on the floor? Does that sound right?

And this "Det ska du få ångra!"
I can't see why få? Why not just say you'll regret it, not "get" to regret it?
Another way of saying this would be "Du kommer att ångra det", right?

User avatar
Crahdol
Japan

Re: får

Post by Crahdol »

Yeah, as you can tell, att få has many uses. You might have guessed it already, but it would be very difficult to consolidate all cases in a handy list. Also, there aren't really any good consistent translation for it either. You'll learn them as you go, hopefully...

As for your most recent examples, I'd say we have 2 cases:

  1. att få träffa - 'to get to meet'. I'd say this one has the same nuance as the English version. If you get to meet someone, consider it a privilege, or perhaps a favor. You need someone else's approval to meet them, hence you get to meet them.

  2. att få <verb> - 'to have to <verb>.' Context really matters here. At a glance, you can't tell if it is supposed to mean 'get to' or 'have to'. Situational context is needed. Generally, if you får <verb> and the verb is something unwanted (like sleeping on the floor) it would translate as 'have to'.

As for the context, the same "thing" can be both positive and negative, depending on the situation.

Example:

  • det var fullt i alla sängar, så de fick sova på golvet istället. = All the beds were full, so they had to sleep on the floor instead.

  • Den trevlige damen släppte in dem, så att de i alla fall fick sova på golvet istället för leran utanför. = The nice lady let them in, so that they at least got to sleep on the floor , rather than the mud outside.

Vänliga hälsningar/Best Regards/よろしくお願いします
Crahdol
| 🇸🇪: Native | 🇬🇧: Fluent | 🇯🇵: N5 |

User avatar
Will709432

Re: får

Post by Will709432 »

Thanks again.

This:
att få träffa - 'to get to meet'. I'd say this one has the same nuance as the English version. If you get to meet someone, consider it a privilege, or perhaps a favor. You need someone else's approval to meet them, hence you get to meet them.
and Generally, if you får <verb> and the verb is something unwanted (like sleeping on the floor) it would translate as 'have to'.

is a very helpful way of thinking about it.

And yes, I'm beginning to see that att få probably can't be tied down the way I'd like as it appears to have so many uses. I'm gradually learning them though. I think :)

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