Unable to edit my own original post?

[CFCUJY]

I posted about an upcoming presentation about Scottish Gaelic a few weeks ago.
Yesterday the presentation recording was posted to YouTube so I thought I would add that link.

However when I went to my original duome post, I didn't have an editing button. I searched around the internet to see if I had forgotten how to edit on duome but all I found was to use the edit button.

I went to my other "original posts" - my own posts - and it looked like none of them had an edit button.

So I added the link to the presentation as a response to my original post. That seems to work.

But I used to be able to edit my own posts so I could add an update into the original post or make a correction. I don't see any email about being "banned" for making a mistake somewhere - although I could be missing that. Plus I'm able to make this post as well as the response to my other post to add the presentation link.

Is this a temporary glitch or am I missing something? Has the edit button moved and I'm just not seeing it?

Thank you.
CFCUJY

[Emi]

You can read an explanation at viewtopic.php?p=119893-reminder-of-guid ... ct#p119893

[CFCUJY]

So, if I understand this, if anyone posts to duome, they cannot delete their own posts and neither can they edit them past an undetermined time frame.
It seems to me this should be a more prominent warning to people before they hit the submit button. [Or maybe all social media is going in this direction and I've missed it.]

I understand the reasoning of the admins, but for me, it will be less likely that I post anything and definitely I wouldn't provide any answer without typing it up offline and thinking about it a while before I post. Maybe that's a good thing.

I still think this revised rule should be a prominent warning, at least for new users.
Thanks for responding so quickly.
CFCUJY

[John Little]

So, if I understand this, if anyone posts to duome, they cannot delete their own posts and neither can they edit them past an undetermined time frame.
It seems to me this should be a more prominent warning to people before they hit the submit button. [Or maybe all social media is going in this direction and I've missed it.]

I understand the reasoning of the admins, but for me, it will be less likely that I post anything and definitely I wouldn't provide any answer without typing it up offline and thinking about it a while before I post. Maybe that's a good thing.

I still think this revised rule should be a prominent warning, at least for new users.
Thanks for responding so quickly.
CFCUJY

I think all bulletin boards/forums are designed that way. I understand your frustration because you only wanted to amend, not change or delete your post. But you could just quote your original post and add the new link.

[HeyMarlana]

Yesterday the presentation recording was posted to YouTube so I thought I would add that link.

If you have a link to add to your post, you're welcome to send it to me via PM and I'll add it to your post on your behalf.

As Emi has stated, yes, it was implemented back in February when we noticed that the edit function was being abused. Some posts were left empty and others were modified, and not for the better, especially where good learning materials were concerned. This was interrupting the flow of conversation, and preventing people from accessing beneficial learning tips or materials from the past. Unfortunately, the actions of a few are now felt by all, and we are sorry for this inconvenience.

Anytime some changes are made on the forum, it will be explained in the Announcements folder.

[Emi]

[…]
I think all bulletin boards/forums are designed that way. […]

I am a recent member in LLORG and after 6 weeks my posts have the edit button, you can see the screenshot:

edit.png (14.87 KiB) Viewed 773 times

and even you can delete them if they are at the end of the queue.

I hardly post in reddit, but my 3 year old posts have the delete option:

edit02.png (67.71 KiB) Viewed 773 times

[…] Unfortunately, the actions of a few are now felt by all, and we are sorry for this inconvenience.
[…]

There is nothing wrong with your decision, but there were alternatives: add these accounts to a special group with those restrictions. Dealing with regular collaborators as if we were toddlers is not the best option in my humble opinion.

[John Little]

I am a recent member in LLORG and after 6 weeks my posts have the edit button, you can see the screenshot:

Here is a quote from the LLORG forum rules re editing and deleting posts.. it's the same principle but there you can be banned for deleting posts!

Deletion-Editing: Removing text from previously posts causes confusion within threads and ruins the continuity of the discussions. If you want to delete your post, use the "Delete" button. Although the information can be recovered, it requires a significant amount of work by the administration team doing data restoration. Deletion-Editing is an automatic ban, the duration of the ban to be determined by the moderators or admin.

[duome]

@Emi, there is no standard option to apply this particular restriction (or ability) only to some specific group. It's a forum-wide setting that cannot be tweaked in any way.

Here is someone having a similar problem 14 years ago, and a reply from phpBB developers: they say that it's not possible with standard phpBB.

In some other thread they suggest requesting an extension capable of doing this, but they're not going to make it a standard feature - not 14 years ago, not in 2025 - we're on our own with this problem.

I'll try to go deeper down into phpBB code to understand the possibilities, yet I'm not the "extension developer" and I'm afraid I would have to dive too deep for my liking, but anyway, I'll see what I can do.

We'll explain it further as soon as we find a solution, if there's a solution.

[HeyMarlana]

...add these accounts to a special group with those restrictions...

Yes, at the moment these would be the mods, who are in a separate group. If anyone is not happy with their post after one week, they can send one of us their editing suggestions to be reviewed.

What's more, those who were sabotaging the forum with dud edits were at one time considered members who contributed with meaningful, helpful, informative content. (There were more than a few that I myself noticed.) If we can't differentiate between well-meaning people who might eventually use their privileges to cause some upset on the forum, then this is the system that is best for the time being.

Sites that don't allow editing such as iTalki, GirlsAskGuys, and social media platforms like Instagram, TikTok, and the free version of X do not have users comparing the non-editing format as being "treated like toddlers". It's a reminder to take accountability for what [you] publicly post, with one week to adjust however [you] see fit. You're not seen as toddlers. You're seen as people who deserve to see a forum intact, free from garbage-edits from those who meant to spoil your enjoyment of the site.

[Emi]

[…]
Here is a quote from the LLORG forum rules re editing and deleting posts.. it's the same principle but there you can be banned for deleting posts![...]

I am not justifying these actions, which I consider a lack of consideration for the rest of the forum members. I have deleted my first account here and I didn't edit my posts, you can read all in their integrity.

It is supposed that you will edit typos, not the gist of your post.
And your answer is not related with your previous post, where you wrote:

I think all bulletin boards/forums are designed that way. I understand your frustration because you only wanted to amend, not change or delete your post. But you could just quote your original post and add the new link.

The question here is that this is a so small forum where several moderation actions are quite excessive. At this moment, included sentence discussions, there are no more then 60 or 70 active topics in a full week, there is almost nothing to moderate.

@Emi, there is no standard option to apply this particular restriction (or ability) only to some specific group. It's a forum-wide setting that cannot be tweaked in any way.
[…]

Thanks for your explanation and for your dedication.
I think you are using a sledgehammer to crack a nut, but it is your decision, that I accept even if I do not share it.

[…] You're not seen as toddlers. You're seen as people who deserve to see a forum intact, free from garbage-edits from those who meant to spoil your enjoyment of the site.

The problem is that eventually no people will post here. You have to asume some risks if you want to succeed.

[HeyMarlana]

You have to asume some risks if you want to succeed.

Yes, Emi. We did take that risk — for nearly three years. In so doing, we lost a lot of valuable information in old posts from members who spoiled it for you.

I understand that a few problematic people who caused this had a view that mods are here to censor. But if you think about it, not allowing an edit after one week actually protects the speech already made, unless... fear of accountability is to be had. If that's the case for anybody, then perhaps a revisit to the community guidelines will help.

Anyway, we've announced it, and implemented it and in the last two months, and the posting activity hasn't changed. It's simple: Post with the use of the generous time of one week to make your edits.

Thank you for your input, Emi. And thank you for all of your contributions on this forum thus far.

[Emi]

[…]
It's simple: Post with the use of the generous time of one week to make your edits.
[…]

I can live with that. I just need a day or a couple of hours to edit my typos in some rare circumstances, it's nothing personal.
But I can understand that some people want to edit something beyond a while.

BTW,

I understand that a few problematic people who caused this …

IIRC, I have reported at least two of that people in the past and the result was that moderators ignored my complains or even considered them almost vital. Now you have the aftermath.

[daKanga]

This is truly sad for me to hear, Emi.

You are a valued member of this community, and your contributions are meaningful.

If I’ve caused you any pain, that saddens me even more. If that’s the case, I sincerely apologize and I invite you to let me know about it - and will welcome hearing about it, to be accountable to it - in whatever forum you are comfortable with.

Just to clarify—I am not a moderator here, nor do I have any behind-the-scenes administrative access like some others do.
Please though - all of you take care here. Each of you matter fundamentally to me.

I see you Emi, have a great heart.

[Emi]

[…]

If I’ve caused you any pain, that saddens me even more. […]

Hi @daKanga !
Don't worry, fortunately I have a real live, I come here only as a distraction, I feel actually like an outsider here, just in a couple minutes I'm going to start my weekend that is exclusive to my family.
Nothing personal in my complaints, I denounce the facts not the person behind them. But I said enough, it is not my responsibility how this forum is progressively fading away.

Have a good weekend!

[rudi]

I am a recent member in LLORG and after 6 weeks my posts have the edit button, you can see the screenshot:

Here is a quote from the LLORG forum rules re editing and deleting posts.. it's the same principle but there you can be banned for deleting posts!

Deletion-Editing: Removing text from previously posts causes confusion within threads and ruins the continuity of the discussions. If you want to delete your post, use the "Delete" button. Although the information can be recovered, it requires a significant amount of work by the administration team doing data restoration. Deletion-Editing is an automatic ban, the duration of the ban to be determined by the moderators or admin.

The big difference to duome is, that there you are allowed to delete your posts. So there is simply no need for Deletion-Editing... and all are satisfied.

[Emi]

I believe in us—as a community.
[…]

I do not understand your last comment at all, it is deviating from the subject of this topic.
IIRC, this is an old debate between you and me, and both know the replies, it is not necessary to insist on it.
The question is simpler: Does this forum need more control?
You have succeed, eventually this forum has an unfinished list of rules. Which one will be the next?

[duome]

it is deviating from the subject of this topic.

.... moved it into its own topic.

[HeyMarlana]

...this forum has an unfinished list of rules. Which one will be the next?

When the forum was initially set up, standard guidelines were put in place with experience from some other forums, mainly from Duolingo's old forum. However, when a unique situation arises here that we need to contend with, in order to protect the community, of course we need to revisit the guidelines and make sure it's understood by everyone that something we didn't foresee happening — won't happen again. It's also a way to prevent someone from saying, "But it's not in the guidelines."

In a perfect world, every registrant would be here to get along with everyone and not find cheap loop holes to damage the integrity of the conversations or resources here. With a forum that has almost 18K accounts, there are bound to be those ready to spam or instigate disharmony. We have to be prepared for that. Any forum or platform with an active administration does this. We all get emails from sites we use saying, "We've updated our terms of service." From Pinterest to YouTube, and many other platforms that provide engagement with others, there are terms. When there are changes, you are notified of them.

[Emi]

...this forum has an unfinished list of rules. Which one will be the next?

When the forum was initially set up, standard guidelines were put in place with experience from some other forums, mainly from Duolingo's old forum.[…]

Are you sure?
This forum has Terms, which are similar to https://forum.language-learners.org/ucp ... e=register, for example.
It is compulsory to agree with them if you want to achieve the registration process.

agree.png (37.63 KiB) Viewed 347 times

If you don't agree, your browser is redirected to a guest version of the forum, in Duome and in LLORG.

A quite different question is that internally moderators based their decisions on Duolingo forum rules.

It's also a way to prevent someone from saying, "But it's not in the guidelines."

Fortunately for moderation, it is impossible to say that. The terms are crystal clear:

"You agree that Duome “Duolingo Forum” has the right to remove, restore, edit, move or close any topic at any time should we see fit. "
Moderators have an absolute arbitrary carte blanche, you don't need a concrete rule.

Related to changes in the rules, my obligation as a user here is clearly stated in the terms:

"We may change these at any time and we’ll do our utmost in informing you, though it would be prudent to review this regularly yourself as your continued usage of Duome “Duolingo Forum” after changes mean you agree to be legally bound by these terms as they are updated and/or amended."

The Terms are translated into several languages, but the German version is different: "Die Änderung wird dem Nutzer per E-Mail mitgeteilt."
The same is true in the terms of LLORG.
This is probably not a coincidence, this is part of the phpBB template.

---

To summarize: The eternal problem of this forum is that you are not following the established procedure.
The Duolingo tradition of posting rules no matter where is a bad example. You can't force users to visit every post by searching for them.

[HeyMarlana]

Emi, on this forum, there are terms of use (which you linked) and there are community guidelines.

We recently inserted that detail about the admin/mods having the right to edit or remove a post as we see fit. Right now, the admin/moderators are the only ones who can edit past the one-week grace period. This is why I have suggested before that if there is a glaring need for a post to be edited that is older than one week, to reach out to one of us so we can review it and apply the edits. As for removal, that too was necessary in recent months when users were leaving [retaliatory] dud or empty posts that didn't make sense, interrupting the flow of discussion for others.

But you know all of this. I guess we're not getting to the heart of the matter. You're annoyed about something, I sense that. It's just that I'm not sure how to explain anything better than I have. Just know that while this is in place, we are still discussing other possible options regarding editing. Tweaking things to solve some problems or improve functionality will be ongoing. All sites undergo maintenance of some form. It's no different here.

On a separate note, there are functions this forum has that Duolingo's forum did not, such as mChat and Private Messaging. When these functions were not (rather, no longer) available on Duolingo, I recall people were incredibly upset and talked about it for years. The decision made to pull those functions was rather final and while the reasons were often repeated in topics, users still wanted to express their resentment about not having it. I guess my point is that, it's expected that users will be annoyed about one thing or another, and will want to talk about it. (Little Tatws' creation of the DDOT each week allowed a space where these grievances could be housed in one topic.) There came a point when the Duolingo forum was wrought with topics about the forum, rather than just being used for what it was intended for. Good language topics were downvote-bombed off the feed, but topics regarding the functionality of the forum took up more discussion space than anything else. I even joked once, "It seems people come to this forum...to talk about the forum."

[Emi]

Emi, on this forum, there are terms of use (which you linked) and there are community guidelines.

[…]

Where are the community guidelines?
Of course, as an old user of this forum I have read something that could be some guidelines, but you have to imagine a new user who doesn't even understand English. These post are quite hidden, you have to search for them and they are not easy to find.

You're annoyed about something, I sense that. […]

Stop!!! You are too close to an ad hominem argument.
It is evident that this forum is going in a serious decline. Active topics are less than 60 in a week, including several sentence discussions, announcements and complaints related to DL.
Is it something worth reading? Almost nothing, and the ambience is boring and depressed.

I do not think we have reached this situation caused by a bad moderation, but it has had a role.

[HeyMarlana]

Where are the community guidelines?

GUIDELINES: We're all in this together
This is included in the other language folders, translated. It's meant to be posted in the discussion folders because not everyone reads through with the terms. (Many people click past them in order to quickly register.)

We also have this additive under the Random Topics, clickable within the bright, mint-green background, just in case both are missed:
Random Topics Guidelines

[rudi]

It really does not make sense to mention the guidelines here, hidden at the bottom of a topic (btw with a completely different header than the discussed topic...). @Emi wrote that he knows where they might be, but for new users they are hard to find.
It is exactly what was criticized.

[HeyMarlana]

for new users they are hard to find.
It is exactly what was criticized.

Emi & Rudi:

Like any site that has user-participation, upon registration, the terms are there and must be agreed to in order for a registrant to continue on as a new user. I'm sorry, but the ToS just can't be any more clear than that with something to check off before a person can participate. If a new user is simply checking it off without fully reading it, and clicking past it just to make an account, we can't help that. The ToS is more about legalities, to protect the forum owner. Aside from that, most people who join any forum or public space to interact with others usually understand to follow the usual etiquette, lest there be consequences.

Which leads me to ask: Are you talking about clarity on how to find the reminders on board etiquette, called GUIDELINES: We're All in this Together? Because the third reminder about rules are found when clicking Random Topics, are at the top within a bright green banner that says "Forum Rules" — which I really can't believe is hard to see.

So if this is the complaint, that the "GUIDELINES: We're All in this Together" topic is something you both believe is in a spot no new users will see then I can take that to the team to discuss any other way to post it. But on a lighter note, as one user commented in that topic: "too bad the obvious has to be stated".

[duome]

We now have Guidelines mentioned in the footer, upon registration, after registration (see the topmost announcement on the homepage).
The announcement can be closed, but it will reappear if something is changed.

I merged the two topics back since the conversation is now more in line with the original topic here - I apologize for the confusion, just in case.