I believe in us—as a community.

[daKanga]

I believe in us—as a community.
One that welcomes difference. One that supports each other. One where we can grow, even when we disagree.

It saddens me when I see anyone being singled out, criticized harshly, or made to feel unwelcome. That’s not the kind of space I hope we’re building together.

We don’t all see the world the same way—and that’s okay. More than that—that is wonderful. It adds depth to our experiences, connecting us to the real-life communities we’re a part of, where we share and contribute to something bigger than ourselves. What matters is how we treat one another in those differences: with respect, care, and patience.

When we focus on who is “right,” or push others to fit into a narrow idea of how things should be, we risk losing something precious: our shared humanity. And sometimes, without meaning to, we cause harm that stretches beyond these screens—into real lives.

If you have a moment, I gently encourage you to listen to this:
BBC Reith Lecture 4 – “Can You Change a Violent Mind?”
https://www.abc.net.au/listen/programs/ ... /105084014
It offers a quiet but powerful reminder of how deeply our words and actions can affect others.

I want to say that I’m truly sorry if anything I’ve done has contributed to someone feeling hurt. That’s not why I’m here.

I’m here because I care. Because I believe in the value of sharing knowledge, encouraging kindness, and building something together that’s bigger than any one of us.

We all come to this space from different paths, with different responsibilities and rhythms. We're all here as volunteers, giving what time we can. And while that’s generous, it’s just as important that we also care for ourselves, our families, and our offline communities—or simply take time to rest. That’s something to respect and appreciate.

To Emi, I’m grateful for what you’ve offered to this community—especially when it’s helped and is helping others learn and grow.

We may not always agree, but I truly hope this remains a space where we try—to understand, to reflect, and to care.

Even when things feel uncertain, I still carry hope for this community.

---

We are more alike than we a different. Goodness is the antidote.

[Emi]

I believe in us—as a community.
[…]

I do not understand your last comment at all, it is deviating from the subject of this topic.
IIRC, this is an old debate between you and me, and both know the replies, it is not necessary to insist on it.
The question is simpler: Does this forum need more control?
You have succeed, eventually this forum has an unfinished list of rules. Which one will be the next?

[duome]

it is deviating from the subject of this topic.

.... moved it into its own topic.

[HeyMarlana]

...this forum has an unfinished list of rules. Which one will be the next?

When the forum was initially set up, standard guidelines were put in place with experience from some other forums, mainly from Duolingo's old forum. However, when a unique situation arises here that we need to contend with, in order to protect the community, of course we need to revisit the guidelines and make sure it's understood by everyone that something we didn't foresee happening — won't happen again. It's also a way to prevent someone from saying, "But it's not in the guidelines."

In a perfect world, every registrant would be here to get along with everyone and not find cheap loop holes to damage the integrity of the conversations or resources here. With a forum that has almost 18K accounts, there are bound to be those ready to spam or instigate disharmony. We have to be prepared for that. Any forum or platform with an active administration does this. We all get emails from sites we use saying, "We've updated our terms of service." From Pinterest to YouTube, and many other platforms that provide engagement with others, there are terms. When there are changes, you are notified of them.

[Emi]

...this forum has an unfinished list of rules. Which one will be the next?

When the forum was initially set up, standard guidelines were put in place with experience from some other forums, mainly from Duolingo's old forum.[…]

Are you sure?
This forum has Terms, which are similar to https://forum.language-learners.org/ucp ... e=register, for example.
It is compulsory to agree with them if you want to achieve the registration process.

agree.png (37.63 KiB) Viewed 237 times

If you don't agree, your browser is redirected to a guest version of the forum, in Duome and in LLORG.

A quite different question is that internally moderators based their decisions on Duolingo forum rules.

It's also a way to prevent someone from saying, "But it's not in the guidelines."

Fortunately for moderation, it is impossible to say that. The terms are crystal clear:

"You agree that Duome “Duolingo Forum” has the right to remove, restore, edit, move or close any topic at any time should we see fit. "
Moderators have an absolute arbitrary carte blanche, you don't need a concrete rule.

Related to changes in the rules, my obligation as a user here is clearly stated in the terms:

"We may change these at any time and we’ll do our utmost in informing you, though it would be prudent to review this regularly yourself as your continued usage of Duome “Duolingo Forum” after changes mean you agree to be legally bound by these terms as they are updated and/or amended."

The Terms are translated into several languages, but the German version is different: "Die Änderung wird dem Nutzer per E-Mail mitgeteilt."
The same is true in the terms of LLORG.
This is probably not a coincidence, this is part of the phpBB template.

---

To summarize: The eternal problem of this forum is that you are not following the established procedure.
The Duolingo tradition of posting rules no matter where is a bad example. You can't force users to visit every post by searching for them.

[HeyMarlana]

Emi, on this forum, there are terms of use (which you linked) and there are community guidelines.

We recently inserted that detail about the admin/mods having the right to edit or remove a post as we see fit. Right now, the admin/moderators are the only ones who can edit past the one-week grace period. This is why I have suggested before that if there is a glaring need for a post to be edited that is older than one week, to reach out to one of us so we can review it and apply the edits. As for removal, that too was necessary in recent months when users were leaving [retaliatory] dud or empty posts that didn't make sense, interrupting the flow of discussion for others.

But you know all of this. I guess we're not getting to the heart of the matter. You're annoyed about something, I sense that. It's just that I'm not sure how to explain anything better than I have. Just know that while this is in place, we are still discussing other possible options regarding editing. Tweaking things to solve some problems or improve functionality will be ongoing. All sites undergo maintenance of some form. It's no different here.

On a separate note, there are functions this forum has that Duolingo's forum did not, such as mChat and Private Messaging. When these functions were not (rather, no longer) available on Duolingo, I recall people were incredibly upset and talked about it for years. The decision made to pull those functions was rather final and while the reasons were often repeated in topics, users still wanted to express their resentment about not having it. I guess my point is that, it's expected that users will be annoyed about one thing or another, and will want to talk about it. (Little Tatws' creation of the DDOT each week allowed a space where these grievances could be housed in one topic.) There came a point when the Duolingo forum was wrought with topics about the forum, rather than just being used for what it was intended for. Good language topics were downvote-bombed off the feed, but topics regarding the functionality of the forum took up more discussion space than anything else. I even joked once, "It seems people come to this forum...to talk about the forum."

[Emi]

Emi, on this forum, there are terms of use (which you linked) and there are community guidelines.

[…]

Where are the community guidelines?
Of course, as an old user of this forum I have read something that could be some guidelines, but you have to imagine a new user who doesn't even understand English. These post are quite hidden, you have to search for them and they are not easy to find.

You're annoyed about something, I sense that. […]

Stop!!! You are too close to an ad hominem argument.
It is evident that this forum is going in a serious decline. Active topics are less than 60 in a week, including several sentence discussions, announcements and complaints related to DL.
Is it something worth reading? Almost nothing, and the ambience is boring and depressed.

I do not think we have reached this situation caused by a bad moderation, but it has had a role.

[HeyMarlana]

Where are the community guidelines?

GUIDELINES: We're all in this together
This is included in the other language folders, translated. It's meant to be posted in the discussion folders because not everyone reads through with the terms. (Many people click past them in order to quickly register.)

We also have this additive under the Random Topics, clickable within the bright, mint-green background, just in case both are missed:
Random Topics Guidelines

[rudi]

It really does not make sense to mention the guidelines here, hidden at the bottom of a topic (btw with a completely different header than the discussed topic...). @Emi wrote that he knows where they might be, but for new users they are hard to find.
It is exactly what was criticized.

[HeyMarlana]

for new users they are hard to find.
It is exactly what was criticized.

Emi & Rudi:

Like any site that has user-participation, upon registration, the terms are there and must be agreed to in order for a registrant to continue on as a new user. I'm sorry, but the ToS just can't be any more clear than that with something to check off before a person can participate. If a new user is simply checking it off without fully reading it, and clicking past it just to make an account, we can't help that. The ToS is more about legalities, to protect the forum owner. Aside from that, most people who join any forum or public space to interact with others usually understand to follow the usual etiquette, lest there be consequences.

Which leads me to ask: Are you talking about clarity on how to find the reminders on board etiquette, called GUIDELINES: We're All in this Together? Because the third reminder about rules are found when clicking Random Topics, are at the top within a bright green banner that says "Forum Rules" — which I really can't believe is hard to see.

So if this is the complaint, that the "GUIDELINES: We're All in this Together" topic is something you both believe is in a spot no new users will see then I can take that to the team to discuss any other way to post it. But on a lighter note, as one user commented in that topic: "too bad the obvious has to be stated".