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The villain committed inhumane actions. Topic is solved

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User avatar
weerwater

The villain committed inhumane actions.

Post by weerwater »

Skill Law2 (feb 2022).

Skurken begikk umenneskelige handlinger
is the proposed DL translation.

Now, I'm just a student here, but still I doubt very much if any Norwegian newspaper would actually use a phrase like this, ever.

How does one 'begå' any 'handling'?

I understand the 'umenneskelige' bit. And that is what I learn from this exercise.
But really... is there a native present here that could make me a genuine Norwegian phrase that would cover the intention of this statement properly? Or maby some sentence that would make the use of the verb 'å begå' better understandable. Thanks.

NB Sentence discussion: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/47972880

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liv
Norway

Re: The villain committed inhumane actions.

Post by liv »

I think this sounds right to me.

User avatar
Artemis
Norway

Re: The villain committed inhumane actions.

Post by Artemis »

weerwater wrote: Wed Feb 23, 2022 11:00 pm

Skill Law2 (feb 2022).

Skurken begikk umenneskelige handlinger
is the proposed DL translation.

Now, I'm just a student here, but still I doubt very much if any Norwegian newspaper would actually use a phrase like this, ever.

How does one 'begå' any 'handling'?

I understand the 'umenneskelige' bit. And that is what I learn from this exercise.
But really... is there a native present here that could make me a genuine Norwegian phrase that would cover the intention of this statement properly? Or maby some sentence that would make the use of the verb 'å begå' better understandable. Thanks.

NB Sentence discussion: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/47972880

Yes, we do use "begå en handling". Or "begå selvmord" ("commit suicide"), "begå en feil", "begå en forbrytelse". It's carrying out an act or action.

Native Norwegian, comfortable in English (C1), learning Greek (A2-B1), know some German and a little Spanish

User avatar
weerwater

Re: The villain committed inhumane actions.

Post by weerwater »

Artemis wrote: Wed Mar 23, 2022 10:12 am

Yes, we do use "begå en handling"
....
It's carrying out an act or action.

Thank you for the Nowegian examples Artemis.
They do indeed confirm the DL construction.

I will continue to have a problem with applying this construction.
In my perception, the verb 'begå' is not needed when 'handling' is used. I would use the verb 'å handle' in stead of that combination:
"Han (hadde) handlet umenneskelig".

But I think I understand what I'm missing:
The difference with 'forbrytelser' or 'feil' etcetera, is that these are qualified acts.
You couldn't 'handle' (or gjøre) those.
There is, however, no name for an act that qualifies as inhumane. So one would need to add 'å handle' (handling) to 'å begå'.

Or ... thinking of that: "Han begikk umenneskeligheter." Perhaps.

My thanks to you both for your help!

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User avatar
Artemis
Norway

Re: The villain committed inhumane actions.

Post by Artemis »

You're very welcome, weerwater!

I don't quite see the problem, though. Maybe it's that you think "handling" is a verb form, but it's not, not here. It's a noun, and it's used like the other ones in this context. It's more vague, because it can cover several things, but as such it is a very useful word.

I guess you can also use "umenneskeligheter" about horrible things that are happening or are carried out (I would equal that with "atrocities"), but in this case I think the translation is better as it is.

Native Norwegian, comfortable in English (C1), learning Greek (A2-B1), know some German and a little Spanish

User avatar
weerwater

Re: The villain committed inhumane actions.

Post by weerwater »

Artemis wrote: Wed Mar 23, 2022 1:59 pm

I don't quite see the problem, though.

Well, it's weird to my ears to use the verb 'begå' without mentioning exactly what it is you are committing.

Must be the native Dutch that's in the way.
In Dutch 'plegen' (to perpetrate) en 'begaan' (to commit) incorporate the meaning 'handelen' (to act). You cannot use it twice in one sentence.
One could never say that a 'handeling werd begaan' or 'gepleegd'. ( act was committed).
Both require a specification of what exactly it is, that has been committed. 'Handelen' simply does not specify anything. Dutch requires a 'feit' (fact).

The construction you are using in Norway appears to lean on English.
But I can only see/begin to understand this difference with Dutch, after having read your affirmative answers. Begå / begaan and handling / handeling are just too close to be false friends ...

So thanks again ;-)

Last edited by weerwater on Wed Mar 23, 2022 5:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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User avatar
Artemis
Norway

Re: The villain committed inhumane actions.

Post by Artemis »

Aha, I see. Yes, I think it must be that they are false friends. I don't know that the Norwegian construction leans on the English, sometimes the constructions are just very close.

"Handling" as a noun is used quite often, and there is quite a limited number of verbs that can be used with it, I think. We can say "utføre en handling", but that is more about doing the act itself, how you perform it. In that sense it can be used about performing operations on a computer, for example.

Often when we say "begå en handling", we don't actually want to specify. It's deliberately vague because the "handling(er)" within a category can be too horrible or indelicate to mention. The type of "handling" or a general description like "umenneskelig", "seksuell" etc. is used instead.

Native Norwegian, comfortable in English (C1), learning Greek (A2-B1), know some German and a little Spanish

Olav
Norway

Re: The villain committed inhumane actions.

Post by Olav »

The translation is correct, but you're right that a norwegian newspaper would never write it. They never put criminals in a bad light.
https://naob.no/ordbok/begå

User avatar
anamorphism

Re: The villain committed inhumane actions.

Post by anamorphism »

it's interesting that you need a more specific noun.

the norwegian use seems to be very similar to my use of to commit. it requires the thing that is being committed to have this meaning (has to be a transitive use), but we can also use general purpose nouns like act, action, deed and thing, in addition to more specific nouns like crime, treason and suicide.

i will say that this transitive use of to commit always seems to be used for negative things, and the dictionary entry for å begå seems to indicate this is also the case in norwegian. you wouldn't tend to say something like "commit an act of kindness."

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